• oyo@lemm.ee
    171·
    6 days ago

    Let’s be fair though. Adobe changes the Acrobat interface every two weeks for no reason. PDF has always been an absolute shitshow, super slow, walled garden format. After like 30 years it’s still a 30 step process to add a note box with an arrow that looks half decent

  • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
    243·
    6 days ago

    > be me
    > zoomer
    > use linux
    > i use linux
    > i don’t know how to use windows, or macos
    > i dont know how to use the most popular operating systems
    > wait
    > i am the joke now

  • Neps@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    73·
    6 days ago

    Yea surprise some people are good at using computers some are bad, has nothing to do with whatever generation someone is apart of, generation labels are so dumb. Literally every “milleinal” I’ve known comes to me for their computer problems.

  • OleDoxieDad@lemmy.world
    1·
    6 days ago

    Converting a PDF to Excel repeatedly on Adobe by clearing the browsing history each time, saves you hundreds a year.

  • SS2k_2003@lemmy.worldEnglish
    1·
    6 days ago

    There should be a class where they force you to install arch Linux without the automated install script and force people to learn how an OS works, or even make them do a Gentoo installation. You only pass it if you get to a fully functioning PC with a web browser and desktop environment

  • ssillyssadass@lemmy.world
    289·
    8 days ago

    Computers have been dumbed down and simplified for the masses. When I was a kid a computer did not cooperate until you raised your voice.

    • IrateAnteater@sh.itjust.works
      147·
      8 days ago

      I do industrial programming. Everything is so far behind that yelling at the “computers” does nothing. Physical violence is just about the only thing they respect.

    • mic_check_one_two@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
      38·
      8 days ago

      Yeah, newer generations have been raised on tech that “just worked” consistently. They never had to do any deep troubleshooting, because they never encountered any major issues. They grew up in a world where the hard problems were already figured out, so they were insulated from a lot of the issues that allowed millennials to learn.

      They never got a BSOD from a faulty USB driver. They never had to reinstall an OS after using Limewire to download “Linkin_Park-Numb.mp3.exe” on the family computer. Or hell, even if they did get tricked by a malicious download, the computer’s anti-virus automatically killed it before they were even able to open it. They never had to manually install OS updates. They never had to figure out how to get their sound card working with a new game. They never had to manually configure their network settings.

      All of these things were chances for millennials to learn. But since the younger generations never encountered any issues, they never had to figure their own shit out.

      • merc@sh.itjust.works
        1·
        6 days ago

        It’s not so much that the tech just worked. Often it doesn’t work. The difference is that when it doesn’t work it’s not user-serviceable. Up until maybe 2010 or so, when things broke there was often something a user could do to fix them. But, especially with the introduction of locked-down mobile phone OSes, that’s not true anymore. Now it’s just “wait for an update”.

      • Zeddex@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        19·
        8 days ago

        Or reinstall the OS on the family computer because one of your dumbass siblings downloaded a sUpeR cOoL song from one of their friends on MSN Messenger.

    • samus12345@lemm.eeEnglish
      16·
      8 days ago

      It was always a struggle to get the damn thing to do what you wanted it to. It turned out to be a good thing long term.

      • M137@lemmy.world
        24·
        8 days ago

        Even as a teenager (didn’t have a computer before that) I had infinite patience with computers, you can fix/change/make anything with enough time, nothing will be better if you get mad and ignore reading and making sure you understand what’s happening. Seeing how young people handle tech now is fucking depressing, they just click past everything without reading, get mad and rage quit after 30 seconds of something not working and think anything that’s more than two clicks/taps is too complicated.

          • M137@lemmy.world
            7·
            8 days ago

            Young, most old people I know either don’t know anything and are fine with that, they get help for even the simplest things, or they can handle it themselves without problems.

  • dual_sport_dork 🐧🗡️@lemmy.worldEnglish
    1832·
    8 days ago

    I can:

    • Accomplish damn near anything from a command line
    • Write machine code
    • Remember a fairly broad swath of special character altcodes without looking them up
    • Disassemble damn near any computer or other machine, and stand a good chance of putting it back together

    But also:

    • Use modern programming languages, including object oriented paradigms
    • Actually read what is on my screen and comprehend it, including error messages
    • Understand and operate any arbitrary interface without having to have it explained to me by rote

    Behold my mixture of skills, and tremble.

    • merc@sh.itjust.works
      1·
      6 days ago

      Write machine code? For what kind of processor?

      That is one ability that doesn’t really belong. That’s much more of a Boomer thing. Not all boomers, obviously, but the ones who were computer experts were the ones who had to learn machine code. By the time even Gen X came along, assembler and C were already much more common.

    • TheEntity@lemmy.world
      127·
      8 days ago

      Can you summarize this in a vertical video? I stopped reading after the third word, I’m here for memes, not to read a damned book!

      • Harold@feddit.nlEnglish
        34·
        8 days ago

        You just made me realize the Zoomers are actually much closer to making Warhammer 40k a reality. IT engineers are like Tech Priests to these Zoomers.

        • partial_accumen@lemmy.world
          11·
          8 days ago

          I don’t know much of Warhammer lore, so I had to look up tech priests:

          "No longer the master of its creations, the Cult Mechanicus is enslaved to the past. It maintains the glories of yesteryear with rite, dogma and edict instead of true discernment and comprehension. For instance, even the theoretically simple process of activating a vehicle’s engine is preceded by the application of ritual oils, the burning of sacred resins and the chanting of long and complex hymns. "

          Its clear to me the author of this block of text was having trouble starting his vehicle’s engine, and was pissed off when he/she was asked to put in a ticket before help would be rendered to the him/her.

          • Genius@lemmy.zip
            54·
            8 days ago

            he/she

            What’s this nonsense? Why don’t you just say “they” like a normal person?

        • mitchty@lemmy.sdf.org
          7·
          8 days ago

          If you’ve never read it Vernon Vinge a fire upon the deep had a type of programmers in the future known as programmer archaeologists. The tldr is nobody wrote new code just dug up old code and bolted it together. I used to think that was silly, after llms lately and dealing with interns I no longer think of it as fiction.

        • AngryCommieKender@lemmy.world
          4·
          8 days ago

          01010100 01101000 01100101 00100000 01001111 01101101 01101110 01101001 01110011 01101001 01100001 01101000 00100000 01100100 01100101 01110011 01101001 01110010 01100101 01110011 00100000 01101101 01101111 01110010 01100101 00100000 01110100 01101111 01100001 01110011 01110100 01100101 01110010 01110011 00100001

      • PolarisFx@lemmy.dbzer0.com
        3·
        8 days ago

        Depends, my browser has mostly taken over as my pdf viewer and I think it lacks the functionality but if I were to install a cracked copy of Acrobat Pro or PhantomPDF then that’s like a 2 click operation.

    • TriflingToad@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
      8·
      8 days ago

      I can

      • reinstall VLC

      oh wait that was all the dependencies VLC needed, I deleted them??, oh no, oh crap. Why isn’t my password working, help???

      (real reason why my first Ubuntu distro got nuked)

      • uranibaba@lemmy.world
        4·
        8 days ago

        I once wanted to move all the files in the folder was I in to another folder and I did something like mv /* ../. What is important here is that I did /* and not ./*. Fortunately it was only a raspberry pi so it went fast to flash the SD card.

        Also, how did you go about reinstalling VLC if you deleted all dependencies?

        • TriflingToad@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
          1·
          8 days ago

          that I did /* and not ./*

          that’s so funny but so sad 😭😭

          how did you go about reinstalling VLC if you deleted all dependencies

          I just distrohopped to kubuntu instead lol

    • Zorsith@lemmy.blahaj.zoneEnglish
      6·
      8 days ago

      I’d argue at a certain depth in an OS its actually harder to do things with a GUI than a command line

    • otacon239@lemmy.world
      5·
      8 days ago

      The day I started learning Regex was the day I felt like I was really learning computers. I went from 2 hour tasks to 15 minutes.

      I doubt you’d even be able to reasonably explain what they are let alone how they work to the average person outside the Millennial generation.

      I fear AI data processing will replace much of the Regex skill set. Why learn Regex when the computer just does it for you… 🙄

      • merc@sh.itjust.works
        1·
        6 days ago

        Silly millennial, even Boomers were using regexen in the 70s, and they were commonplace by the time GenX nerds started playing with them in the 80s and 90s. Your elders also know that regexen are fun but extremely dangerous, and should only be used in cases where they won’t make things much worse.

      • mearce@programming.dev
        1·
        8 days ago

        I agree that regex is an important thing to learn. Not sure any old LLM would do a very good job, and I hope that no tool replaces people actually learning how to write regex.

        I’m not sure what you mean about the average person outside the millennial generation not understanding them, though. Maybe I’m mistaken, but I don’t think the ‘average’ person in any generation knows what regex is. Unless there is some reason the average millennial was actually exposed to them and forced to understand them?

        As for being doubtful that anyone could understand them aside from a millennial, I assume you’re being hyperbolic? Sort of sounds like “Kids these days can never learn what I learned!” (I’m teasing).

        Anyway I’m in agreement with you. This thread did remind me of a pretty neat project that, while still requiring domain knowledge, could save some time and be a good learning tool without being as fallible of a crutch as an LLM.

        Have not tried it, and am not an experienced developer, so I am curious to your thoughts/criticisms: https://github.com/pemistahl/grex

        • otacon239@lemmy.world
          2·
          8 days ago

          Yeah, I am exaggerating a bit, but I’ve not met anyone under the age of 25 that’s even remotely interested in putting in the effort to learn (anecdotal, I’m aware). Many have expressed wanting to learn, but then they never follow up when I try and pursue teaching anything.

          And I’m not necessarily saying that the average person already understands them, but someone from our generation will probably pick them up far more quickly then your average Gen Z/Gen A.

          • mearce@programming.dev
            2·
            7 days ago

            Maybe what you’re claiming is true, I don’t know whether is ‘probable’.

            I poked fun at this before, but I don’t think it came across. If I’m not mistaken, millennials were the subject of a lot of boomer complaints about “kids these days”, being called lazy or entitled etc…

            Maybe zoomers are dumber, maybe they’re full of microplastics and entitlement. Or maybe this thread is an example of the “chastise the next generation” history repeating. One generation is lumped together and shat on by older generations, some of which then make similar claims about the next generation(s) all backed up with nothing but anecdotes and confirmation bias.

            I’m not trying to take dig at you, but I do want to highlight the similarities between claims like these and when a boomer might’ve said “I know a millennial who spends more on coffee than I would, so millennials are bad with their money. Millennials, who are bad with their money, cant afford houses. Yet they act entitled to homeownership, and so, they are lazy.” It’s a claim that assumes something about the integrity and intelligence of a swath of people and ignores the systemic issues that made homeownership hard for many millennials compared to past generations.

            Again, maybe you are right, I do not know. I don’t think, though, that boomer rhetoric that shat on millennials as a whole was particularly accurate or productive.

            • otacon239@lemmy.world
              3·
              7 days ago

              I certainly don’t blame them for these pitfalls I don’t think it’s laziness. It’s 100% a lack of education. Teachers have all but given up trying to get kids to pay attention in class. It’s become a snowball effect.

              When I was in school, most of my classmates took it seriously and took much of the education at face value. And almost all of my classmates are people that could handle the full Office suite.

              Now it seems every kid thinks they already know computers because they started with an iPad at the age of 4, but what they don’t realize is phones and tablets are the equivalent to toys.

              You don’t ever actually learn how to use a phone. Just individual apps. People don’t even really browse the internet blindly anymore.

              I think it’s probably the difference that a lot of boomers probably saw with cars in the 2000s-2010s. It used to be everyone had a rough idea of how a car worked and most people could learn in a year or two how to do basic stuff.

              Now it’s all a closed magic box requiring a full technical degree. Phones fell the same. Its a magic box that they never had the opportunity to wonder how it worked.

        • PolarisFx@lemmy.dbzer0.com
          2·
          8 days ago

          That’s a good idea actually. I hate writing regex, so I asked Gemini to do it just now. Once I explained it in the format it wanted: what the source would be, what I wanted filtered and the language I planned to use it with it spat out a perfect expression without me needing to even use my brain. Technology is wonderful.

          • mearce@programming.dev
            1·
            8 days ago

            I’m sure LLMs can get it right, but if I was going to use a tool for something like that, I’d want one that was more deterministic like the linked tool claims to be.

    • Chris@lemmy.world
      62·
      8 days ago

      Why would you write machine code outside of uni! Assembly exists for a reason?

    • Emerald@lemmy.world
      3·
      8 days ago

      Understand and operate any arbitrary interface without having to have it explained to me by rote

      Omg, this all the way. I’m in a class for learning AWS stuff and its crazy the amount of people who suddenly can’t do anything when one button is on a different screen than the instructions told them it was. Like come on, use some basic thinking skills.

      Another infuriating situation was having to do a class on Microsoft Office. It was infuriating because it was incredibly basic stuff. I’ve never used Outlook before, but I completed each task they asked of me in like 5 seconds because I have a basic understanding of how software works.

    • kazaika@lemmy.world
      31·
      8 days ago

      … modern … Object oriented

      wat?

      Bro that shits like 30 years old and most langs released after lets say 2010 have put that stuff in the backseat for backwards compatibility. Anyway I get your point

      operate any arbitrary interface

      Dont believe it. Behold the shittyness of modern UI

    • baines@lemmy.cafeEnglish
      1·
      7 days ago

      Bobby no one’s paying you for this shit, go show Billy how to sum numbers in Excel.

    • Emerald@lemmy.world
      1·
      8 days ago

      Remember a fairly broad swath of special character altcodes

      I use the compose key. When you message with me, you are sure to receive proper dashes and real ellipsis.

      Well, unless I happen to be using my phone or another computer at the time.

      • doctordevice@lemmy.ca
        2·
        8 days ago

        Hold on — why can’t you do proper ellipses and dashes on your phone? I don’t understand…

        This message brought to you by Android.

        • Emerald@lemmy.world
          1·
          8 days ago

          Well there is no em dash or en dash key on the mobile keyboard. And there isn’t a … key either.

          • doctordevice@lemmy.ca
            3·
            8 days ago

            I typed my comment above on my mobile keyboard. I’m just using the standard Google keyboard on my Pixel, nothing fancy. Em and en dash are available by holding on the hyphen, and the ellipsis is available by holding on the period (annoyingly, only when on the numbers/symbols page).