The Christian god tells his followers to push the religion onto as many as possible and punish those who don’t believe.
Source: history and current events.
If god wanted his followers to believe quietly, he’d have written his book differently. I have to assume, since he’s perfect and all knowing, that the outcome was the goal. Otherwise he’s a HUGE screw up.
Yes yes, free will. But god knows about free will, and still chose to write the book the way he did. So he intended the outcome that exists.
1 Take care not to practice your righteousness in the sight of people, to be noticed by them; otherwise you have no reward with your Father who is in heaven.
2 So when you give to the poor, do not sound a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, so that they will be praised by people. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full. 3 But when you give to the poor, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4 so that your charitable giving will be in secret; and your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you.
5 And when you pray, you are not to be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and on the street corners so that they will be seen by people. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full. 6 But as for you, when you pray, go into your inner room, close your door, and pray to your Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you
Very easy to cherry pick when you ignore the book of Joshua and Deuteronomy. Which include genocide, enslavement, ethnic cleansing and other atrocities, all committed by direct order of that deity.
There are some rather stark differences between the old and new testament depictions of God. The only two ways to reconcile the differences imo are that either Jesus led a pretty standard major-religion-themed-psychedelic-“love”-cult or that the Gnostics were on to something about this reality being a prison created by a divine abomination and that Jesus was trying to save us from the OT “God”.
That’s an old school Gnostic interpretation, and that in part lead to the development of Christian antisemitism. (See Reuther, Faith and Fratricide)
You’re missing out on the hundreds of years of Jewish scholars navigating and interacting with the text. It’s easy to understand the shift as discrete, because Jesus is a clear breaking point, but a lot of that develops from Greek philosophy interacting with Judaism. He was most assuredly influenced by Nazarite thinkers too.
Keep in mind too that Jesus said he brought not peace, but a sword. Jewish understandings of the messiah at the time were seeking a military type leader to lead them against the Romans - that threat is probably what actually got the man crucified. Read Luke 22:36.
Seeing these kinds of r/atheism versus Christian conversations is always a shit show. Everyone is wrong.
Or there is no god and the cunts running this religious sharade benefit from adding as many sheep’s under them as possible and are using religion as an excuse
Easy, because most people do. Be it by indoctrination of their children, justification of atrocities, or by feeling self righteous, it is almost always a tool of coercion.
And people who think they’re above of it all, and who think their lukewarm faith is the answer, are disgusting to the creature they claim to serve, as per the Book of Revelation, chapter 3, verses 15-16.
Christian crusaders and missionaries forced people to adopt Christianity and genocided populations, erasing entire cultures, but now that Christianity is in the majority it’s easy to say Christianity has nothing to do with imposing itself on the world. It’s already been imposed.
Evangelicals overtly continue the evil legacy of their missionary forebears, but all of Christianity bears that legacy.
That’s true, but in fairness all of humanity bears that legacy. The crusaders weren’t doing what they did just because of Christianity, it was because they were humans, doing what humans always do.
People in power have always used religion as a tool to further their own ends. It’s true throughout history, it’s still true today.
You are absolutely a human being with dignity. I even have family who are Evangelicals and we get along well enough, though I dip whenever they try to bring up religion.
I was commenting on religion and its legacy. Of course you are not personally responsible for the Christianization of the world, or the cultural genocide of Indigenous people in residential schools.
I just think that the “I’m not like other Christians!” thing always rings a little hollow. You are a part of the religion that is the #1 weapon and driver of colonialist projects (including Canada!). The foundation is rotted.
Well that’s good i guess. Most people dont view Christianity that way though. Most Christians think its their job to spread Christianity far and wide, and therein lies the problem.
It’s a book, a collection of stories written second and third hand by a bunch of guys who lived thousands of years ago, and then rewritten by the catholic church, and many others to suit their needs. You’re not going to convince me that it was misinterpreted. I dont even know why we are having this conversation honestly. You can keep your faith, thats fine. I dont want, nor do I feel the need to share it.
Personally, because I take offense at anyone who proudly worships the creature who killed tons of babies and kids, just for being the firstborn of a culture and not taking in the religion of another group just for being the correct one, imposing rules on a whim and turning those who failed into salt, testing faith by asking someone to kill their child, burning up cities because it disagreed with with how some of the people in it lived, and many other atrocities.
But more to the point, because I think it is disgusting to worship a creature so powerful and stubborn that after so much interference, now allegedly just says “I’m a hands off parent now, I don’t care if you poke your eye out, commit Holocaust or poison and kill men, women and children by pretending to be acting in my name, I’ll just judge you after you die, k, tks, bye”
You claim to be against the sins that form the basis of your religion, and I respect that, but one can’t turn a blind eye to what the scriptures say.
And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”
Stop trying to pander your beliefs towards atheists and unbelievers who want nothing to do with God. They aren’t our authority
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
It’s not being a good person that saves you.
Acts 16:31
And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”
Matthew 7:22-23
On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’
James 2:18-22
But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works. You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder! Do you want to be shown, you foolish person, that faith apart from works is useless? Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up his son Isaac on the altar? You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by his works;
What love is it to let someone wander into Hell? That’s not loving at all! Yes, we should be good people and do good and show our faith by it, and share our faith in a calm and respectful manner- not soapboxing on a street. But we should still share our faith.
As long as Christians should share their faith and create new disciples, that’s fine. Other commenters seemed to say that we shouldn’t, though. And your comment did come across as “look at me, I can meet your atheistic standard, too!”
![[Sephko] ZORORO](https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/25740d77-f5c2-4658-87c7-5aced94f0800.jpeg){kind=link}
Books are where it’s at!
The Christian god tells his followers to push the religion onto as many as possible and punish those who don’t believe.
Source: history and current events.
If god wanted his followers to believe quietly, he’d have written his book differently. I have to assume, since he’s perfect and all knowing, that the outcome was the goal. Otherwise he’s a HUGE screw up.
Yes yes, free will. But god knows about free will, and still chose to write the book the way he did. So he intended the outcome that exists.
Sure, that’s what the book says. But that’s not the actions the book produces. And an all knowing God would know the outcome of the words he chose.
Very easy to cherry pick when you ignore the book of Joshua and Deuteronomy. Which include genocide, enslavement, ethnic cleansing and other atrocities, all committed by direct order of that deity.
There are some rather stark differences between the old and new testament depictions of God. The only two ways to reconcile the differences imo are that either Jesus led a pretty standard major-religion-themed-psychedelic-“love”-cult or that the Gnostics were on to something about this reality being a prison created by a divine abomination and that Jesus was trying to save us from the OT “God”.
That’s an old school Gnostic interpretation, and that in part lead to the development of Christian antisemitism. (See Reuther, Faith and Fratricide)
You’re missing out on the hundreds of years of Jewish scholars navigating and interacting with the text. It’s easy to understand the shift as discrete, because Jesus is a clear breaking point, but a lot of that develops from Greek philosophy interacting with Judaism. He was most assuredly influenced by Nazarite thinkers too.
Keep in mind too that Jesus said he brought not peace, but a sword. Jewish understandings of the messiah at the time were seeking a military type leader to lead them against the Romans - that threat is probably what actually got the man crucified. Read Luke 22:36.
Seeing these kinds of r/atheism versus Christian conversations is always a shit show. Everyone is wrong.
Or there is no god and the cunts running this religious sharade benefit from adding as many sheep’s under them as possible and are using religion as an excuse
Books are where it’s at!
Why represent the idea of God as truth if it really all comes down to personal headcanon?
Because if morality is dictated by God, and God is whatever you want, you can justify literally anything.
Books are where it’s at!
Easy, because most people do. Be it by indoctrination of their children, justification of atrocities, or by feeling self righteous, it is almost always a tool of coercion.
And people who think they’re above of it all, and who think their lukewarm faith is the answer, are disgusting to the creature they claim to serve, as per the Book of Revelation, chapter 3, verses 15-16.
Christian crusaders and missionaries forced people to adopt Christianity and genocided populations, erasing entire cultures, but now that Christianity is in the majority it’s easy to say Christianity has nothing to do with imposing itself on the world. It’s already been imposed.
Evangelicals overtly continue the evil legacy of their missionary forebears, but all of Christianity bears that legacy.
That’s true, but in fairness all of humanity bears that legacy. The crusaders weren’t doing what they did just because of Christianity, it was because they were humans, doing what humans always do.
People in power have always used religion as a tool to further their own ends. It’s true throughout history, it’s still true today.
Books are where it’s at!
You are absolutely a human being with dignity. I even have family who are Evangelicals and we get along well enough, though I dip whenever they try to bring up religion.
I was commenting on religion and its legacy. Of course you are not personally responsible for the Christianization of the world, or the cultural genocide of Indigenous people in residential schools.
I just think that the “I’m not like other Christians!” thing always rings a little hollow. You are a part of the religion that is the #1 weapon and driver of colonialist projects (including Canada!). The foundation is rotted.
Books are where it’s at!
Well that’s good i guess. Most people dont view Christianity that way though. Most Christians think its their job to spread Christianity far and wide, and therein lies the problem.
Books are where it’s at!
No, its the spreading of the word. I grew up christian, my partner grew up Catholic. You’re not telling me anything I dont already know.
Books are where it’s at!
It’s a book, a collection of stories written second and third hand by a bunch of guys who lived thousands of years ago, and then rewritten by the catholic church, and many others to suit their needs. You’re not going to convince me that it was misinterpreted. I dont even know why we are having this conversation honestly. You can keep your faith, thats fine. I dont want, nor do I feel the need to share it.
Books are where it’s at!
Why’s he being downloaded he’s the sensible one, probably all the other shitty Christians down voting him lol
Books are where it’s at!
Personally, because I take offense at anyone who proudly worships the creature who killed tons of babies and kids, just for being the firstborn of a culture and not taking in the religion of another group just for being the correct one, imposing rules on a whim and turning those who failed into salt, testing faith by asking someone to kill their child, burning up cities because it disagreed with with how some of the people in it lived, and many other atrocities.
But more to the point, because I think it is disgusting to worship a creature so powerful and stubborn that after so much interference, now allegedly just says “I’m a hands off parent now, I don’t care if you poke your eye out, commit Holocaust or poison and kill men, women and children by pretending to be acting in my name, I’ll just judge you after you die, k, tks, bye”
You claim to be against the sins that form the basis of your religion, and I respect that, but one can’t turn a blind eye to what the scriptures say.
With love, a former seminarian.
Books are where it’s at!
Matthew 28:18-20
Stop trying to pander your beliefs towards atheists and unbelievers who want nothing to do with God. They aren’t our authority
Matthew 5:18. You better not be wearing any mixed fabric right now you heathen.
Books are where it’s at!
Good works apart from faith don’t make you saved.
Ephesians 2:8-9
It’s not being a good person that saves you.
Acts 16:31
Matthew 7:22-23
James 2:18-22
What love is it to let someone wander into Hell? That’s not loving at all! Yes, we should be good people and do good and show our faith by it, and share our faith in a calm and respectful manner- not soapboxing on a street. But we should still share our faith.
Books are where it’s at!
As long as Christians should share their faith and create new disciples, that’s fine. Other commenters seemed to say that we shouldn’t, though. And your comment did come across as “look at me, I can meet your atheistic standard, too!”
Books are where it’s at!