It’s so crazy that I’ve never met one then, only people with takes that are nuanced and are based on non-CIA approved sources (although I really think this only applies to Xi, I’ve never seen a single person supporting Putin)
Seriously though, I think you’re pre-emptively blocking out what people are actually arguing just because you perceive it to be russian or chinese or whatever propaganda. Almost everyone I’ve talked to/seen has had reasonable takes that are based on evidence, and a huge part of that is asking why they believe what they do instead of just screaming “TANKIE” at them
Yeah. I haven’t seen a single person actually praise Putin, because he has not achieved a single thing worth of defense and praise in all of the years he’s been Russia’s leader.
Xi however is a different case. His country is doing very well on many metrics and is threatening to overtake the US hegemony on the world stage. Around the time when China seemed to start catching up to the West, you started reading about how China literally was 1984 irl.
Outfits connected to the same US that is the single biggest reason for everything bad in the middle East and the Islamic world started condemning China for islamophobia. These same US based outfits also condemned China for worker abuses, despite the fact that their country was built on the backs of slaves, and still utilities the labour of millions of undocumented immigrants. That’s not to speak about how prisoners are used as cheap workforce in America.
The US and its propaganda arm has spewed so many lies and destabilized so many regions that I simply cannot trust anything they say about any other country – especially not a well-positioned rival. Why is China the eternal Big Bad? The same atrocities the Chinese are accused for have been committed by many allies to the yanks, with comparatively non-existent backlash and critique. The US lies to accomplish its strategy goals, something that even the blindest US shill can’t deny. Is it that unbelievable that they would lie about China?
Then you look at China and see a nation that isn’t only threatening the US position as the world leader, but also doing much more in service of its people than all American presidents since Reagan combined. You notice how narratives about “social credit scores” are exaggerated beyond parody without any criticism in Western media, and your trust to the West’s judgement of other nations starts to falter.
Why would I believe the US and its rhetoric about China? I know they don’t give a single fuck about human rights, they just want to “win”. To me, it’s more likely that the majority of whatever China is accused of doing is exaggerated or simply untrue.
That’s what leads me to “defend” the country. I’m not Chinese, I don’t live there and I gain nothing by being positive to them. However, westerners talk about China with such racism that I simply refuse to partake in. Westerners are also guilty of far uglier crimes and should therefore just zip it.
I also love to see that there exists a government that can jail billionaires and force them to pay their fair share to the people from which these leeches get their riches. In the US, you’re supposed to eat a rich man’s shit with a grin.
I haven’t seen a single person actually praise Putin, because he has not achieved a single thing worth of defense and praise in all of the years he’s been Russia’s leader.
That’s not actually true. Putin first two terms coincided with super high oil prices which brought in a shit ton of revenue. His administration used that money to stabilize the ruble and ensure consistent payments of state wages and pensions, which for the decade prior had been totally chaotic and people were not just angry but in serious economic precarity. That alone earned him a massive amount of popular support. Basically, he presided over a decade of standard of living increases that had seemed impossible before he was elected.
Their “houses are for living, not for speculating” slogan.
China’s government might be actually doing something with that… Just to by the other hand harden their mass control and mass surveillance even more; not for anything they have one of the biggest — if not the biggest — regional firewalls (maybe just behind North Korea’s one) — the GFW. Then also they have “Reeducation Camps”, and all that stuff that any good fascist dictatorship has. Not to forgive Xi Jingping image cult.
So yeah, at what cost? It’s at the cost of their freedom.
Oh, and China has other parties outside the Chinese Communist Party? To think, ladies and gentlemen.
Fair points I guess, but I’d like to point out that a lot of these were made as defensive measures against outside interference and aren’t actually all that different from stuff NATO countries are doing right now. Their mass surveillance isn’t driven by corporations trying to extract every last penny off of you, which is more than what any NATO country can say. You can also just get a VPN in China and access the outside internet relatively easily. And what Xi Jinping image cult? I’m pretty sure that ended with Mao. There are also other political parties in China BTW, although they only serve advisory positions to the CPC. Not saying any of this stuff is good, of course, just that it’s not that much worse, or in some cases even better, than rival countries. Maybe someone more knowledgeable about China can explain this better.
Their “houses are for living, not for speculating” slogan is an example.
China’s government might be actually doing something with that… Just to by the other hand harden their mass control and mass surveillance even more; not for anything they have one of the biggest — if not the biggest — regional firewalls (maybe just behind North Korea’s one) — the GFW. Then also they have “Reeducation Camps”, and all that stuff that any good fascist dictatorship has. Not to forgive Xi Jingping image cult.
So yeah, at what cost? It’s at the cost of their freedom.
Oh, and China has other parties outside the Chinese Communist > Party? To think, ladies and gentlemen.
China and the US has some of the same issues, and also issues more unique to both.
The US takes on imperialism and human rights… Or rather lack thereof is a shared value with China.
The US and Chinese economies are both relatively fucked, based on financial speculative growth and has limited upwards possibility for their youths. Look at the American GenZ hate towards work and reciprocated reaction from employers, look at the laying flat movement in China. Which is banned to even mention on social media.
Go to any major Chinese (Tier I and II) city and your first reaction will leave you in awe. Everything looks great on the surface, but how do you achieve cheap motorcycle deliveries within minutes? By having a large, lost, low class of workers. Selling their time for peanuts, barely able to scrape by. Potentially being shipped medicine by parents, as seen in a Danish travel programme recently.
The US has the same kind of gig economy, but not nearly to the same psychopathic degree China does.
Both economies have fucked up rural areas, just like most of the world, low key forcing people to move towards population centers to find work - Said centers ends up flooded with labour.
International human rights abuse? Yeah the US is worse, but that’s most likely due to the US being everywhere.
Domestic human rights abuse? If you think the UK or US is censored, learn Chinese and visit their social media. A picture of Winnie the pooh? Gone. Mentioning laying flat? Deleted.
Then we have the Uyghurs, Hong Kong not being respected for the one hundred year lease initially agreed upon, stole the Dalai because they can’t accept Tibet isn’t Chinese.
International conflict, 9-dash line, no signs of wanting to finalise the Chinese civil war still ongoing with Taiwan, continued support of Russia despite them being behind the bloodiest current war on our planet.
Not to talk about the AI cold war the two states are running at the moment, neither side has dared to say it publicly and neither side have shown any signs of wanting to stop the ongoing cold war for the betterment of our planet.
Is the US the good guys? Nah.
I’m personally growing more and more annoyed with my own government and the EU as a whole not being willing to take a harder stance against the US. Trump made the blunder of a lifetime, but the Hormuz is still closed instead of trading energy in Euroes - Benefitting everyone but the US. The world economy would had taken a rollercoaster ride, but it would benefit all of us long term.
Both the Chinese, American and Russian leadership is a cancer to the planet, and more countries should recognise them as such
Yes they’re from 3 Lemmy instances, one of them being yours.
It’s so crazy that I’ve never met one then, only people with takes that are nuanced and are based on non-CIA approved sources (although I really think this only applies to Xi, I’ve never seen a single person supporting Putin)
Seriously though, I think you’re pre-emptively blocking out what people are actually arguing just because you perceive it to be russian or chinese or whatever propaganda. Almost everyone I’ve talked to/seen has had reasonable takes that are based on evidence, and a huge part of that is asking why they believe what they do instead of just screaming “TANKIE” at them
Yeah. I haven’t seen a single person actually praise Putin, because he has not achieved a single thing worth of defense and praise in all of the years he’s been Russia’s leader.
Xi however is a different case. His country is doing very well on many metrics and is threatening to overtake the US hegemony on the world stage. Around the time when China seemed to start catching up to the West, you started reading about how China literally was 1984 irl.
Outfits connected to the same US that is the single biggest reason for everything bad in the middle East and the Islamic world started condemning China for islamophobia. These same US based outfits also condemned China for worker abuses, despite the fact that their country was built on the backs of slaves, and still utilities the labour of millions of undocumented immigrants. That’s not to speak about how prisoners are used as cheap workforce in America.
The US and its propaganda arm has spewed so many lies and destabilized so many regions that I simply cannot trust anything they say about any other country – especially not a well-positioned rival. Why is China the eternal Big Bad? The same atrocities the Chinese are accused for have been committed by many allies to the yanks, with comparatively non-existent backlash and critique. The US lies to accomplish its strategy goals, something that even the blindest US shill can’t deny. Is it that unbelievable that they would lie about China?
Then you look at China and see a nation that isn’t only threatening the US position as the world leader, but also doing much more in service of its people than all American presidents since Reagan combined. You notice how narratives about “social credit scores” are exaggerated beyond parody without any criticism in Western media, and your trust to the West’s judgement of other nations starts to falter.
Why would I believe the US and its rhetoric about China? I know they don’t give a single fuck about human rights, they just want to “win”. To me, it’s more likely that the majority of whatever China is accused of doing is exaggerated or simply untrue.
That’s what leads me to “defend” the country. I’m not Chinese, I don’t live there and I gain nothing by being positive to them. However, westerners talk about China with such racism that I simply refuse to partake in. Westerners are also guilty of far uglier crimes and should therefore just zip it.
I also love to see that there exists a government that can jail billionaires and force them to pay their fair share to the people from which these leeches get their riches. In the US, you’re supposed to eat a rich man’s shit with a grin.
That’s not actually true. Putin first two terms coincided with super high oil prices which brought in a shit ton of revenue. His administration used that money to stabilize the ruble and ensure consistent payments of state wages and pensions, which for the decade prior had been totally chaotic and people were not just angry but in serious economic precarity. That alone earned him a massive amount of popular support. Basically, he presided over a decade of standard of living increases that had seemed impossible before he was elected.
Xi may be doing things well, but with a truly distopic fine-print beyond every single good thing.
Yes ofc. Keep moving the goal posts :D
such as…?
Their “houses are for living, not for speculating” slogan. China’s government might be actually doing something with that… Just to by the other hand harden their mass control and mass surveillance even more; not for anything they have one of the biggest — if not the biggest — regional firewalls (maybe just behind North Korea’s one) — the GFW. Then also they have “Reeducation Camps”, and all that stuff that any good fascist dictatorship has. Not to forgive Xi Jingping image cult.
So yeah, at what cost? It’s at the cost of their freedom. Oh, and China has other parties outside the Chinese Communist Party? To think, ladies and gentlemen.
Fair points I guess, but I’d like to point out that a lot of these were made as defensive measures against outside interference and aren’t actually all that different from stuff NATO countries are doing right now. Their mass surveillance isn’t driven by corporations trying to extract every last penny off of you, which is more than what any NATO country can say. You can also just get a VPN in China and access the outside internet relatively easily. And what Xi Jinping image cult? I’m pretty sure that ended with Mao. There are also other political parties in China BTW, although they only serve advisory positions to the CPC. Not saying any of this stuff is good, of course, just that it’s not that much worse, or in some cases even better, than rival countries. Maybe someone more knowledgeable about China can explain this better.
“at what cost” lol
“But at what cost??” ass take.
Copy-paste because I have things to do:
Do you apply the same scrutiny to whatever western country you twerk for?
China and the US has some of the same issues, and also issues more unique to both.
The US takes on imperialism and human rights… Or rather lack thereof is a shared value with China.
The US and Chinese economies are both relatively fucked, based on financial speculative growth and has limited upwards possibility for their youths. Look at the American GenZ hate towards work and reciprocated reaction from employers, look at the laying flat movement in China. Which is banned to even mention on social media.
Go to any major Chinese (Tier I and II) city and your first reaction will leave you in awe. Everything looks great on the surface, but how do you achieve cheap motorcycle deliveries within minutes? By having a large, lost, low class of workers. Selling their time for peanuts, barely able to scrape by. Potentially being shipped medicine by parents, as seen in a Danish travel programme recently.
The US has the same kind of gig economy, but not nearly to the same psychopathic degree China does.
Both economies have fucked up rural areas, just like most of the world, low key forcing people to move towards population centers to find work - Said centers ends up flooded with labour.
International human rights abuse? Yeah the US is worse, but that’s most likely due to the US being everywhere.
Domestic human rights abuse? If you think the UK or US is censored, learn Chinese and visit their social media. A picture of Winnie the pooh? Gone. Mentioning laying flat? Deleted.
Then we have the Uyghurs, Hong Kong not being respected for the one hundred year lease initially agreed upon, stole the Dalai because they can’t accept Tibet isn’t Chinese.
International conflict, 9-dash line, no signs of wanting to finalise the Chinese civil war still ongoing with Taiwan, continued support of Russia despite them being behind the bloodiest current war on our planet.
Not to talk about the AI cold war the two states are running at the moment, neither side has dared to say it publicly and neither side have shown any signs of wanting to stop the ongoing cold war for the betterment of our planet.
Is the US the good guys? Nah.
I’m personally growing more and more annoyed with my own government and the EU as a whole not being willing to take a harder stance against the US. Trump made the blunder of a lifetime, but the Hormuz is still closed instead of trading energy in Euroes - Benefitting everyone but the US. The world economy would had taken a rollercoaster ride, but it would benefit all of us long term.
Both the Chinese, American and Russian leadership is a cancer to the planet, and more countries should recognise them as such
Between all the three, China doesn’t even deserve to be in the same breath. You’re just trying to defend your beloved US
Finally, someone that’s reasonably and logically minded, between so much polarized people.