I’ve recently gotten into reading. I realised how much I love fiction, and a couple of tropes. So I’m here asking maybe some of you know any books that have them.
I love it when the story focuses more on world building rather than character. The theory crafting I can do in my head, or just before I sleep, is priceless.
Here I’ll contradict myself by saying a character development related point, but the more important one. I’d like to read more works that show some mysterious big-bad first as a rivalry, later as a friend. They soften up with the MC and we they become friends or allies or whatever. We get to see a BBEG of sorts’s friendly and weak side. I get that it’s a bit childish, but I lost my mind of how cool of a character they made the first time I read it. Now, it was in a manga, so I’d love to read an example that made this best or first.
Thank you in advance, even if you just name some genres or authors.
The Discworld series has nice world building, however the individual books focus on different characters for telling a story and getting to know that world.
If anyone is interested in Discworld for world building, then I’d recommend skipping the first few books. They were written before Terry Pratchett had a good grasp on the world and the characters. They can be worth coming back to later, but I definitely recommend not starting with them. “Wyrd Sisters” and “Guards! Guards!” are pretty good entry points.
I would even go further back, and recommend Equal Rites.
I’m partial to Ankh-Morpork and the City Watch for some reason ;)
If you like world building then check out Brandon Sanderson and his cosmere related books. They all play out within the same cosmere and all build upon that same world with different stories. I started with Mistborn and think that is still my favourite but it is a hard decision as there is a lot of good books / series.
You could also try Stephen Kings - The Dark Tower and then go down the rabbit hole of a plethora of other books that all happen within the same world and have various different connections to The Dark Tower books and midworld.
N.K Jemison - The Broken Earth trilogy was pretty decent in terms of building the world it was set in and I think is pretty highly regarded for that element.
If you want a bit of space operas then I think Simon R Greens - Deathstalker books are really great and build a whole quirky universe for itself.
Maybe check a few of those out :)
Cosmere feels like it focuses on politics. If I’m right I’d rather not read it. I’m not even interested in real life politics.
I heard a buch of praise for Stephen King and someone else also said the dark tower. I think I’ll give it a shot.
Couldn’t find a wrong word for The Fifth Season, it got on my list.
I don’t think Deathstalker is for me.
Still, thanks! I’m probably set for a long while.
I thought dark tower was okay, but it was a bit too surreal for me towards the end.
Might I recommend the Mortal Engines quartet? They’re kinda YA, especially the first one, but the setting is as far as I know completely unique, and beyond amazing. I really don’t want to spoil the first few moments of realization, so I’m just going to put the first two passages below.
Also, many of the BBEGs are cool af and (spoiler for the later books) as least one matches your request exactly, while others match it pretty well.
Honestly I love the characters, they work so well. Especially Tom, he’s the most normal everyday lead I’ve ever read in a fantasy/sci-fi book, and yet all his actions are totally believable.
My only complaint is that book 2 is kind of frustrating in places.
First two passages:
It was a dark, blustery afternoon in spring, and the city of London was chasing a small mining town across the dried-out bed of the old North Sea.
In happier times, London would never have bothered with such feeble prey. The great Traction City had once spent its days hunting far bigger towns than this, ranging north as far as the edges of the Ice Waste and south to the shores of the Mediterranean. But lately prey of any kind had started to grow scarce, and some of the larger cities had begun to look hungrily at London. For ten years now it had been hiding from them, skulking in a damp mountainous, western district which the Guild of Historians said had once been the island of Britain. For ten years it had eaten nothing but tiny farming towns and static settlements in those wet hills. Now, at last, the Lord Mayor had decided that the time was right to take his city back over the land-bridge into the Great Hunting Ground.
I thirst for befriending “bad” guys, so you sold me. Rest of the text was wasted /j. I won’t even read reviews, I trust you stranger.
Please get back to me with your impressions, especially on the “befriending bad guys” side. I’d love to know (even if you end up disliking it)!
Well, just finished reading the first book. I took my sweet time lol. If I have to give a one sentance review I’d say that “I’d like to like it”. The ending was very good, and I’m looking forward for their andventures. However all of part one and the first half of part two were spiteful.
The main characters survived everything with plot armor, they all should have died. >!When they got thrown off a multi story moving city, soft ground is a bullshit excuse, there weren’t even injured. Later Kate asked the antagonist about his secret evil plans, and were just sent away, Tom got “killed”. You could argue they just got lucky or “you wouldn’t be reading about them if nothing extraordinary happened”. But you can’t even argue that a terminator just shut down, it’s batteries emptied, JUST when it was about to kill Hester. And Tom was praised, he got bitch slapped, and almost died!!< I also feel like the charscter development was a little bumpy, but it’s talking about scenarios that I never faced before or ever thought about, so instead of criticising it maybe I should learn from it? Still, at the end characters started dropping like flies, it was supposed to be emotinal, but because of the above mentioned reasons it didn’t feel impactful. Nevertheless, I enjoyed it. The writer wrapped things up so well, that I’m looking forward of the next piece.
Long wall of text over. I was expecting some high fantasy sort, with the bbeg criteria, but I didn’t know that a post-post-apocalyptic world goes this hard. While none of my negatives have any weight if you factor in the fact that this is probably a kid’s book.
Shaw reminds me of Silksong…
Hey, thank you so much for the wall of text!
Yes, most of what you mentioned is what I was vaguely including with the term “YA.” I’ve read a lot of it so I’m very inured to the silly tropes and unlikely and dramatic deus ex machinas. It’s great to hear your negatives because I’m seeing my own blind spots!
I think your criticism is valid. I don’t think it’d be correct to call any impression-based criticism invalid. Doesn’t mean one can’t also learn from it. Additionally, the negatives might make sense in context of it being YA, but that doesn’t make them weightless imo.
I liked the second book the least by far, but maybe it’ll be different for you. I’m sorry the BBEG wasn’t up to snuff, I was absolutely convinced. Maybe books 3/4 will do it but it’s mostly in the same vein. I’m glad you still enjoyed it!
I’m not familiar with Hollow Knight, but if you say there’s similarity maybe I should be…
Lol, my last line was a joke. A shot in the dark hoping you might get it. In the game Hollow Knight, there is a character called Hornet. She’s getting a whole game, called Silksong. Anyways, the game only has sounds as voiceacting and Hornet says “Shaw” a lot. (You can try searching “Hornet Shaw” on Youtube if you’re curious, but I warn you of the brainrot, the community is insane)
I already started with book#2. Was just planning on reading it a bit when I noticed your reply. It’s written way to well for me to just drop it. I’ll (try to) drop by when I’m done.
Hello, it’s me again. With a book club-like update. Just finished the 2nd book, Predator’s Gold. However I’ll just say it straight on, it was bad. The plot armor driven plot didn’t subside. I remember you saying that you liked the 2nd least, so I guess… same. I honestly don’t feel like reading the next two.
I don’t think I’ll over-analyze this one, but I’ll just say that it was so uninteresting and boring that I’ve put off the last chapters for days, read them one by one. And the big drop at the end, the climax, was, again, complete nonsense. >!Tom survived getting shot point blank in the chest. The stalker 2.0 got autobalanced (tf2 reference) in the middle of killing the MCs. Hester did something so unreasonable that it is in no way justifiable as a tantrum. One of the most feared predator cities just killed themselves. And the drop of Hester being pregnant is irritating, very “book end” of it, but also let’s think about it. For the 2nd half of the book they weren’t even close to each other, except for when They came back from the “prison” and when Tom was dying. So there are two options: Hester had intercourse with a dying(unconscious) guy (peak fiction?), or they tried for baby when they were speeding back to the city, when it was clearly uncomfortable for the both of them. I won’t read back, but IIRC they were both filled with guilt and barely talked. Or did they have fun in the early chapters? In that case, good to know a city can move half a world’s length within a couple of months (before pregnancy is noticeable or a hindrance)! !<
I’ll think this is the end of my journey with this one, overall it wasn’t bad, I’m just disappointed a bit. And definitely not interested enough to continue. However, if you say that the next two books are good (AKA way better), I can imagine myself reading them and writing up the first two as setup.
Hello, thank you for the update!
Oh boy I didn’t even notice the pregnancy plot hole you pointed out. I read the second book once as a kid and never again.
I’m really sorry to have put you through that D=
The third and fourth books are indeed completely different, but I hesitate to suggest reading them because of your experience so far. My personal ranking is 4 > 1 > 3 > 2. I do think they go interesting places as they have more traditional fantasy scope and characters, so the world is fleshed out a lot. But it is still more of the same…
Anyway, thank you so much for the time taken to review them. I liked your analysis. Do you have a favorite book to recommend?
I’m really sorry to have put you through that D=
haha, don’t be :D I’m happy that I met this world. It’s just not that good.
I don’t have a favorite book. I’m very new to reading books. 21st century childhood got to me as well. But I’m enjoying it so far. Might even me a better form of media than series. While I’m also not native, and for whatever reason I don’t read in my mother tongue, but english. For that reason I struggle with vocabulary. One good thing I can definitely say about Mortal Engines is that the language is simple, I barely had to look stuff up.
I can tell you manga or smth tho.
Best I could do was to bookmark your comment. If I remember I will, but for obv reasons I can’t make promises.
No worries, I don’t expect anyone to remember random internet stranger number seven thousand one hundred and eight. But, just in case =D
I do agree that it does get weaker towards the end, I think after King got hit by the car in real life the writing for this series went down hill. I enjoy the first 4 books the most, then it is a steady decline however it never reaches bad for me still and I have still read through it multiple times.
I also enjoy the majority of his books though and a lot of the ones that tie into this universe are amazing books in their own right but the fact they build into a bigger world than that which exists within the books themselves appeals to me a lot.
I will also look into your suggestion :p
Oh yes I’m a sucker for sprawling, disjointed worldbuilding. It’s what ended up pulling me into fan fiction. Maybe I should try dark tower again. I’ll put it back in the “maybe” pile.
No worries, I hope you find something you enjoy.
I would say that I personally can’t stand politics in the real world or in stories so I am with you on that and I don’t believe any of the cosmere stuff focuses on politics at all. Dune is something politic heavy and whilst I made it through it eventually it took me four or five tries and I probably wouldn’t return.
I highly recommend trying out at least the first mistborn book to see if you like it if you get to a point where you are in need of something else to read after you’ve worked your way through some other suggestions.
Happy reading :)
It’s possible I missjudged it. Not like I read the whole thing to say that. I can tell that you enjoyed it, so it can’t be bad. I’ll look into it, but no promises :p
Haha no that is fair and yes I enjoyed it a lot, I just don’t think it is very political so wanted to make that point in the hope you don’t miss out on a great world ;p
it’s on my radar. I just go so many so good options now, didn’t even got around looking into all of them yet. I tought I’d get like 1-2 comments or not even. Thank you.
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Looked into it, and The Books of Earthsea is downloading (.epub). Thanks! I’m hyped.
Three Body Problem is great for if you want more world-oriented experiences than character-oriented ones. The character in focus changes often and sometimes harshly, but I feel it’s in service of the plot and feels great.
I think you may like Expeditionary Force series, there is quite a bit of what you are looking for.
I guess Asimov Foundation series would also be a good candidate for world building.
The dark tower series.
Read the Wheel of Time, talk to you in 3 years
I think I heard the name once, but I don’t know anything about it. Why? what
Not the same guy, but I started reading it a few weeks ago and just finished the fourth book last night. It does a pretty good job at both world building and character development in my opinion (though it really shines across books). In my opinion, the first book does a good job of introducing new elements of the setting at a good pace, and uses it’s characters who know little of the world to impart how special/rare some of the things are.
Still donno why be said see you in 3 years. Is it that long?
It’s a 14 book series. It’s generally acclaimed for its world building and depth, but understood to be a bit of a slog in the middle. The original author, Robert Jordan, died while writing the 12th book, and Brandon Sanderson was chosen by Jordan’s widow to finish the story using notes left by Jordan for his successor. I never finished it myself but I understand these final works were very well received, and Sanderson is a great author himself.
Oh, yeah, they have a reputation for being long. There are 14 books total I believe, and each is pretty long.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wheel_of_Time
That said, I was able to read the first the books with an average speed of a book a week (though I spent a lot of the weekends to do so), so I wouldn’t say they’re crazy huge books.
Empire of man series. Main character starts as a twat almost nobody really likes, then he gets better.
It’s military science fiction https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire_of_Man
At bottom of wiki article is link to read first book for free
Dungeon Crawler Carl and The Bobiverse are both amazing series that are worth a glance at.
These are probably not what I’m looking for. But now I know where that one wierd first person rogue like came from. Thanks!
Watership Down
The “Death Gate Cycle” by Weiss and Hickman has all that. Great worldbuilding, bad guys that become friends, etc.
I’m sold. I love myself some high fantasy, and you don’t have to tell me twice about the last part. I won’t miss a chance to experience that again. Thanks!
Shadow of the Wind by Carlos Ruiz Zafon.
First in a series called the Cemetery of Forgotten Books.
A young boy named Daniel is taken by his bookstore-owning father to the Cemetery of Forgotten Books.
By tradition, first time visitors are allowed to select one book for which they will become a lifetime guardian.
Daniel chooses “Shadow of the Wind” by Julian Carax and quickly becomes enthralled by it. As he tries to find out more about the book and the author, he finds that someone is systematically collecting all of Carax’s works and burning them.
I’ll leave the thrillers for my dad. Still, I feel the love in this reply, so I’m sorry. I don’t think I’ll be reading this.
Not really a thriller, more of a mystery + a love story. It’s a fantastic read. Especially considering it was translated from Spanish.
You can try the “Malazan book of the fallen” series. It’s very fast paced which I like but probably isn’t everyone’s cup of tea.
I’m reading that it sacrifices way to much consistency for it’s speed. I’m a sucker for consistency. While it sounds fun, it doesn’t sound like much of it if I’ll just overanalyze the plot holes and ruin the whole thing for myself. Thanks, still.
The Silmarilion
Literally world building
I recommend Locked Tomb series. It has both of youre asking for. Also, such badass protagnist and overall great writing.
I looked it up the the first this I saw was “Doctor Sex”. Peak fiction. Anyways, do I read the “half” books (The Mysterious Study of Doctor Sex, As Yet Unsent, The Unwanted Guest)?
I’m sorry maybe you found the wrong series. I’m talking about series with the books-Gideon The Ninth, Harrow The Ninth and Nona The Ninth. Its written by Tamsyn Muir
Holy shit. I just looked up what you’re talking about. I didnt even read those. Those are some random side stories. Start with Gideon The Ninth. Excuse me while I read Doctor Sex now :D
Alright, will do. I have already started Mortal Engines, but this is def 2nd, the covers and titles are way too cool and edgy for me not too read it while im still a teen. Ods are that you’ll finish this sooner than I’ll finish a quartet so if you remember I’d love to hear an updated “what to start with” or if these extra stories are any good.
Thanks for recommending them tho.
PPS, Dr Sex sounds much more scandalous than it is. Its actually Dr Sextus and I dont think he’s ever called Dr Sex in the mainstream books iirc. But Muir is the Mother of Memes so I won’t say it’s beneath her to call him that.
